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Post by washboardchris on Mar 23, 2010 14:13:10 GMT
Hi, bear in mind that the guitars you were listening to both have the same non original cones in them and that there is a huge price difference.You would have to look hard to find a style O from the 30s that dosent need work doing to it for less than £2.500 - £3000 .I have a style O from 1934& that sounds different from both of these(Much more bass and a warmer sound all round)but that has the origanal cone in it and a huge huge baseball bat neck which probably adds to the sustain.A better test for you would be a lightning(around £500) and a national resophonic stvle O (around £1300 second hand)or compare a Delphi & a blues which have steel body's
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Post by bod on Mar 23, 2010 16:06:57 GMT
Hi Geoff
Maybe I'm misconstruing what you say, but in your most recent post in this thread it sounds a little like you might be trying reach conclusions about a recent National Reso-Phonic instrument on the basis of a clip of an old National, but as I understand it these are not only from different eras they are also from different companies, apparent similarities in the name notwithstanding. (I'm not making any further claims about the brands or instruments involved - just that they are from different manufacturers, so conclusions about one made on the basis of listening to the other will be ill-founded).
Cheers
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Post by geoff on Mar 23, 2010 16:41:39 GMT
Hmmm, yes you are right.
I want to compare some modern NRP models with their MM/Busker counterparts. I think I narrowed my choice down to these options.
This because I can get both good sounding options for roughly the same price, but a NRP will take a lot of time for a used one to come by. Believe me they do, for about 600 to 700 euro, however strange this may seem. But if I can be convinced the MM/Busker are only 15% less overal, or even 100% equally good but only different, I may just as well go for that option...
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Post by gouranga on Mar 23, 2010 19:12:24 GMT
Hey Geoff old buddy.. If you can pick up NRP's at 600to 700 Euro, If they are in real good nick. You got a real good business there my old buddy and you may even find a few business partners on here to go with, or at least a good few customers. I can get you Resos that are badged NRP, but they are not the real thing. Please don't take this comment in the wrong way. Thanks
Regards
Gouranga
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Post by geoff on Mar 23, 2010 20:56:44 GMT
Haha, I understand your message. It's not like that. I know this guy, who is close to some very rich guitar lovers. They tend to swap them around for these prices. But then again, you never know when they come around. Last time, one of these men dumped three of them. Or sometimes they want to swap it for another guitar they are holding at that moment, which sometimes is a good deal. So the source is good but very unpredictable! It feels a bit like fishing; you know they are there but when will you catch one....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2010 0:38:23 GMT
Hi Geoff, Here are a couple of youtube clips that you might find useful - sorry if you've already seen these.
This one has a various guitars including a couple of republics which come from the same factory as MM and busker guitars.
This clip is one I found useful in getting a handle on the difference between brass, steel and german silver. They're all Nationals and NRPs, but it's a good selection.
cheers col
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2010 6:15:27 GMT
I presume you are saying my opinion doesn't count!? That's OK I'm getting sick of your thred anyway. Just go buy a bloody guitar. You are never going to get the true sound over the net. You say you can get a National like mine cheap through your rich friends. Well get one and stop asking all these inane questions!! Okay Bluebottle, you say they sound alike. Well that gives me an impression about your opinion. Thank you for that. I think they do sound different, but hey, opinions aren't facts. Then I found this Youtube movie. It may not be a top notch recording, but I think it is good enough to hear the differences between a "real style O" and a Lightning. The style O sounds dryer to me with a cleaner attack and somewhat better separation of the individual notes. More balanced so to say. The Lightning sounds a tiny bit more "sloppy" but still very nice. If only there was a Delphi versus Lightning movie, then I could judge the nasal bluesy difference. I seem to be the only person in the world who thinks brass has a smaller spectrum. I'm having a hard time deciding between a used NRP or new Lightning, that's how good I think it is...
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Post by growler on Mar 24, 2010 8:25:17 GMT
HI bluebottle I tend to be in agreement with you on this one ............... how the hell would anyone buy a guitar on the strength of what they have heard over the internet
regards
Growler
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Post by gouranga on Mar 24, 2010 9:42:22 GMT
Gentlemen please. Shanti!! (be peaceful). Let the man have his say. Whether it be to your liking or not, we should be tolerant and that way people will take us more seriously, including our opinions, in due course of time. People want to know they are valued as with your opinions. No offense intended guys.
Take care and best wishes.
After all we do keep saying IMO or IMHO. They are only opinions and opinions are like assholes, every bum has one, but of course not nice to stick it in everyone's face or you may get it kicked.
Gouranga my friends be happy IMO..
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Post by gouranga on Mar 24, 2010 14:23:55 GMT
Sorry Chris.. I am not linking with what you are trying to say. Could you please simplify it for this less intelligent soul. Thanks.
Take care and all the best folks
Gouranga
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Post by gouranga on Mar 24, 2010 14:26:39 GMT
Do we often misunderstand what someone is trying to present in their posts at time? I often think it's possible.
All the best
Gouranga
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Post by wolvoboy on Mar 24, 2010 15:10:37 GMT
Hi guys if your going to buy a vintage reso you want one that is as original as you can get it, imo opinion if you buy one thats had a neck reset and new cones its not original you might as well buy a new National reso and will probably sound more like a new one than a vintage guitar,i think that Snakehips has done comparison with a National reso and a MM blues i think both had hot rod cones fitted,i think, i cant find the thread, but there was not a great deal of difference sound wise. the way i see it no two guitars are the same especially vintage reso,s all the ones i have played have their own unique sound,but having seen Michael Messer in concert playing a 12 and 14 fret (mm blues)a lot of the sound depends on the player, and Michael makes them sound fantastic,and for the money are the best on the market,if you want better spend more money.there is also a few guys on the forum that have vintage Nationals and new National reso,also have MM Blues or Lighnins that says it all to me,not out to cause world war three just my opinion!! wolvoboy
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Post by robn on Mar 24, 2010 19:18:26 GMT
...the way i see it no two guitars are the same especially vintage reso,s all the ones i have played have their own unique sound.... Very true - there is not one "National" sound - but varieties on a wonderful theme. ...having seen Michael Messer in concert playing a 12 and 14 fret (mm blues)a lot of the sound depends on the player, and Michael makes them sound fantastic... When Michael visits Busker we sit down and play guitars. I'll play one and think the guitar sounds great - I'll hand the guitar to Michael and he'll get 30% more tone out of it I ask him how he does it, and he just says "35 years!" A great sounding guitar is only a starting point - it is a tool. It needs to be in the hands of a craftsman to make it sing. One of the great aspects of resonator guitars is that they are really physical instruments - there is one hell of a lot of the player in the tone. A good reso is like a good violin - there is great tone hiding within the instrument - but it takes skill and musicianship to bring it out. I love that close connection that the player has with these instruments. Hand a reso around and it will sound different in each players' hands - more so than other guitars. A good reso will have that potential for great tone within it - just don't expect to get it all out without plenty of practice. You as a player have to work the guitar for tone. And that's what makes these guitars so special - they are alive!!!! Many of you have emailed me and told me just how much the tone on your guitars has developed as they have settled in. Whilst settling does take place, I expect that 50% of that tonal development you are hearing has actually come from your playing improving as your hands quietly are learning how to tease out the tone without telling your head what they are doing Robin
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2010 20:00:33 GMT
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Post by washboardchris on Mar 24, 2010 20:07:59 GMT
Hi, in my view, if you but an MM guitar and don't get on with it, you wont lose much if you sell it; and, if you buy a second hand NRP at a good price, you wont lose anything on it if you sell it. What you are losing, by agonising about what to buy, is playing time. If you are spending months or years working out what to buy, you lose all that time when you could be playing. BUY OR BORROW A GUITAR & START PLAYING IT !!!!!!!!!
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