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Post by Bottleneck John on Jun 28, 2022 16:35:54 GMT
So, has anyone of y'all here built your own magnetic pickups? I've been at it for a year or so now, from time to time and I can't get my pickups any thinner than around 7-8mm's.. I know there's the Sixtus and FlatPups etc. And they would work on my old Duolian for sure when it comes to height/thickness but they're so HUGE otherwise, haha! The thickness is cool on those but I'm looking for a smaller singlecoil style pickup. Like 5 mm's thick. I have copper wire and magnets everywhere. So I might give it one more go if a good idea/design is revealed to me!  Have you built "The smallest thinnest magnetic pickup in the world" ?? Btw, how thin is the old version of the singlecoil Lace Sensor, I remember those as being really thin for resonators?? Thanks for any input,folks! (I badly need to get my old Duolian going amplified without piezos or microphones, I dream of the day we can be on stage together, haha!!) 5 mm's, no more! |
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Post by Bo Grohl on Jun 28, 2022 17:28:01 GMT
What would be great would be for someone to take apart a sixtus pickup to show us what's inside.
Any volunteers?
TT
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Post by Pickers Ditch on Jun 28, 2022 18:17:39 GMT
Youtube post from the man hisself!
I understand that neodymium button magnets are used - these are available on ebay and Amazon.
Keep us up to speed please, John.
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Post by Stevie on Jun 29, 2022 8:00:35 GMT
It's a trade off between inductance and resistance which affects the resonant peak which in turn makes one pickup sound subjectively "better" than the next. Using neodymium magnets, the resultant higher magnetic field means that for any given length of wire you end up a higher inductance, but you also end up with lower resistance because you need fewer turns, all things being equal which they seldom are. This is why quoting the resistance of a pickup using a multimeter is pointless, and some of Leo's early single coils have really low resistance but sound wonderful.
Then there is the effect of layer winding as against scatter winding. This affects the overall resistance with it's impact upon inductance and hence resonant peak, not to mention microphony. Since you are trying to squeeze it all into a perhaps unfeasibly small package, you will be forced into layer winding which means more resistance yada yada.
Basically you have to follow the well trodden path of sucking and seeing and deciding whether or not you like what you hear. If and when you do get a result, given the mojo fueled pickup market, there will probably be less incentive to share with others ...
For obsessive pickup research, you could do a great deal worse than to follow the contributions of "antigua" on the Proboards guitarnutz2 forum. If you were prepared to loan one to him, he would greedily analyse it and tell you of things that even the manufacturer is probably unaware, right down to magnet material, bobbin material, eddy currents in chosen metals, turns count, resistance, inductance, resonant peak, loading imposed by circuit topography (such as potentiometers etc) and so on and so forth.
There is also a seminal treatise on pickups by a Gernan fellow which I believe has just been up-issued. Unfortunately it is quite naturally written in German but there may be a translation in print. The main obstacle however is not language but cost. I'd have to do some digging to find a link if prodded.
でつ e&oe ...
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Post by snakehips on Jun 29, 2022 8:12:26 GMT
Hi there ! National-Resophonic's current version of Krivo-built pickups look good - and are apparently 6mm tall at their tallest part (beteen the 3rd & 4th strings, with the top surface of the pickup actually having a radius like the fretboard, rather than the usual flat top surface. www.nationalguitars.com/product-page/national-slimline-pickup?utm_campaign=2bb393fb-9144-4a1a-b872-49f616392838&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=2482b97b-3497-4de5-8610-1eec5c158464Of course, that 6mm quoted depth is not including the double-side adhesive tape (I think) - so I don't know what the ACTUAL height would be once taped down onto a guitar. Interestingly, the pickup, like I think all magnetic pickups, has a flat underside ...... and NRP guitar (and often vintage National guitar) body tops have a bit of an arh to them - so it will potentially see-saw over the curved guitar top. Thus, I recommend only using the double sided tape under the 5th-6th and the 1st-2nd strings, to only stick the pickup down at each end of the pickup. That way, the middle portion iof the pickup will actually sit flush to the guitar body in the middle - and have a real 6mm effective height ! But will it give enough clearance to the 1st & 6th strings ?? Also, are the polepieces inside the pickup set in a radius, height-wise ? The pickup looks cool - with nickel-plated mirror-finish and the word "National" etched onto it. Price is less cool - but maybe worth it, if it sounds great - and does what you want it to do. |
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Post by thinline72 on Jun 29, 2022 9:48:58 GMT
No affiliation and I don't own one yet by myself, but there is another choice for 6mm magnetic pickup: 12barbluespickups.com/index.php/resonator-guitars/Not sure if it includes the adhesive tape, but I guess it's possible to reach out to them about that. Interestingly, in the About section they say: "We build the lowest profile pickups in the world (as thin as 2mm) so they can easily slide under the strings of various instruments.". So maybe there are other options or a custom order option too. |
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Post by Pickers Ditch on Jun 29, 2022 10:47:41 GMT
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Post by richclough on Jun 29, 2022 13:05:58 GMT
Hi there ! National-Resophonic's current version of Krivo-built pickups look good - and are apparently 6mm tall at their tallest part (beteen the 3rd & 4th strings, with the top surface of the pickup actually having a radius like the fretboard, rather than the usual flat top surface. www.nationalguitars.com/product-page/national-slimline-pickup?utm_campaign=2bb393fb-9144-4a1a-b872-49f616392838&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=2482b97b-3497-4de5-8610-1eec5c158464Of course, that 6mm quoted depth is not including the double-side adhesive tape (I think) - so I don't know what the ACTUAL height would be once taped down onto a guitar. Interestingly, the pickup, like I think all magnetic pickups, has a flat underside ...... and NRP guitar (and often vintage National guitar) body tops have a bit of an arh to them - so it will potentially see-saw over the curved guitar top. Thus, I recommend only using the double sided tape under the 5th-6th and the 1st-2nd strings, to only stick the pickup down at each end of the pickup. That way, the middle portion iof the pickup will actually sit flush to the guitar body in the middle - and have a real 6mm effective height ! But will it give enough clearance to the 1st & 6th strings ?? Also, are the polepieces inside the pickup set in a radius, height-wise ? The pickup looks cool - with nickel-plated mirror-finish and the word "National" etched onto it. Price is less cool - but maybe worth it, if it sounds great - and does what you want it to do. Hi all, I have a Krivo on my NRP Style 1. It's a really nice mirror finished pickup. It's not 'radiused' like the ones made for National, however, the pole pieces are accessible (screw in/out) which means I can adjust for balance on a set of phosphor bronze strings with a wound third. I wonder how the new National Krivo would fair with phos bronze strings? The double sided tape adds an extra few mm. I needed to experiment a bit to get the pickup flush as possible with the end of the fingerboard - as Snakehips says the area is not flat. TBH, the pickup starts choking the strings up above the 15th fret, but given that I rarely fret (just slide) above the 12th it's not an issue. My Krivo, is not much different to a Sixtus sound-wise; Sixtus is thinner, a lot cheaper, also has adjustable pole-pieces, but doesn't look as good. I have a spare in the box in case my Krivo ever dies (no it's not for sale!). Best regards, Rich |
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Post by Bottleneck John on Jun 29, 2022 18:49:39 GMT
Hi there ! National-Resophonic's current version of Krivo-built pickups look good - and are apparently 6mm tall at their tallest part (beteen the 3rd & 4th strings, with the top surface of the pickup actually having a radius like the fretboard, rather than the usual flat top surface. www.nationalguitars.com/product-page/national-slimline-pickup?utm_campaign=2bb393fb-9144-4a1a-b872-49f616392838&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=2482b97b-3497-4de5-8610-1eec5c158464Of course, that 6mm quoted depth is not including the double-side adhesive tape (I think) - so I don't know what the ACTUAL height would be once taped down onto a guitar. Interestingly, the pickup, like I think all magnetic pickups, has a flat underside ...... and NRP guitar (and often vintage National guitar) body tops have a bit of an arh to them - so it will potentially see-saw over the curved guitar top. Thus, I recommend only using the double sided tape under the 5th-6th and the 1st-2nd strings, to only stick the pickup down at each end of the pickup. That way, the middle portion iof the pickup will actually sit flush to the guitar body in the middle - and have a real 6mm effective height ! But will it give enough clearance to the 1st & 6th strings ?? Also, are the polepieces inside the pickup set in a radius, height-wise ? The pickup looks cool - with nickel-plated mirror-finish and the word "National" etched onto it. Price is less cool - but maybe worth it, if it sounds great - and does what you want it to do. I totally agree that it looks awesome but still, it's way to big. The thickness is cool but nothing else. Half that size and it's getting close to how it should be!! :-D Just as wide as the end of the fretboard and then half it's current size, that would be excellent. Maybe someday they'll make it smaller? Is it a humbucker? Is that why? A singlecoil should be smaller I'd say.
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Post by Bottleneck John on Jun 29, 2022 18:54:29 GMT
No affiliation and I don't own one yet by myself, but there is another choice for 6mm magnetic pickup: 12barbluespickups.com/index.php/resonator-guitars/Not sure if it includes the adhesive tape, but I guess it's possible to reach out to them about that. Interestingly, in the About section they say: "We build the lowest profile pickups in the world (as thin as 2mm) so they can easily slide under the strings of various instruments.". So maybe there are other options or a custom order option too. Seems like a very nice pickup! Thickness is ok. I wonder if they can make it in the size of a "standard" singlecoil but with that height, that would be total success!! |
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Post by Bottleneck John on Jun 29, 2022 19:00:32 GMT
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Post by Michael Messer on Jun 29, 2022 19:48:31 GMT
They're all just magnetic pickups with a certain number of windings that each maker believes is right for a resonator guitar. For me, the closest anyone got to it was Elmar Zeilhofer with his Sixtus and MM pickups. However, none of these products, Krivo, Sixtus, MM, Lace, etc etc... come even remotely close to what was achieved by the Highlander company. To me they all do exactly the same thing in varying degrees of quality, they convert an acoustic resonator guitar into an electric guitar that sounds a bit like a resonator guitar. Whereas Highlander managed to create a pickup that actually amplifies the real tone of a resonator guitar. I recently got a Fishman Platinum Pro EQ, and I have to say that used with a Highlander it comes pretty darn close.
For me I still maintain that the only true and pure way to amplify a resonator guitar is to use a microphone, or a Highlander if you really need to plug in for the extra volume. I know many would disagree with me, but that's fine.
Shine On
Michael
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Post by bonzo on Jun 29, 2022 20:04:29 GMT
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Post by slide496 on Jun 29, 2022 21:50:36 GMT
No affiliation and I don't own one yet by myself, but there is another choice for 6mm magnetic pickup: 12barbluespickups.com/index.php/resonator-guitars/Not sure if it includes the adhesive tape, but I guess it's possible to reach out to them about that. Interestingly, in the About section they say: "We build the lowest profile pickups in the world (as thin as 2mm) so they can easily slide under the strings of various instruments.". So maybe there are other options or a custom order option too. Seems like a very nice pickup! Thickness is ok. I wonder if they can make it in the size of a "standard" singlecoil but with that height, that would be total success!! Hi, The 12bar I tested for a ladderbraced flat top I returned, but he ships with volume control, and he included command strips to attach both parts the pickup and volume control, he was a good communicator. No affiliation. Best, Harriet |
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Post by Stevie on Jun 30, 2022 7:52:32 GMT
This thread was about a request for intelligence from folks who had made / wound their own pickups wasn't it?
でつ e&oe ...
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