Looking for tuner gear/wheel 1934 Style “O”

[3acorns]

I have my Dad’s National 1934 Style “O” (original owner). One of the gear wheels is stripped (see photo). Does anyone know where I can find a replacement? I have temporarily replaced the entire tuner assembly with a new one from National. It works, but looks bright and new. I want to keep it looking original. Thanks. 

[snakehips]

Hi there !

I think I might be able to help you with that. Where are you in the world ?

I have one side tuner plate (the bass side) with one of the buttons broken off (the metal post end is inside the button - so the metal post itself broke !).
The strip I have is the exact same type of engraved tuner plates (there were two distinct engraved types, as far as I can tell, maybe more ?).

This came from my bandmate's (circa 1932/33) National Polychrome Triolian. I was working on the guitar, and unwinding the strings off when the tuner broken !
Luckily, I had a SPARE bass-side tuner set of the exact same version of tuners, from one of my Nationals that I'd taken off. My tuners were even better than his, condition-wise BUT he always managed to tune AND keep in tune his guitar with the original set - so, I believe the wheel/cog thingy should be good enough.

Before you right off the tuner on your Dad's guitar, I take it you tried oiling the moving parts and tightened the screw that holds the wheel/cog in place ?
Not too tight that the cog won't turn, but not too loose that you have tuning problems ?

If so, get in touch.

[3acorns]

Thanks for the quick reply Snakehips. I'm in Santa Rosa CA. I tried everything with the tuner, but a couple of the teeth on the gear/cog are worn down. It worked if I wound the string backwards, but that caused the string to rub the edge of the slotted headstock. Your wheel/cog would be a perfect solution.

How do you suggest we proceed?

Here's my Dad playing with slide for the first time. When he was a kid he played it at church with his sister on piano. The strings were way too high. He must have had tough and strong fingers. I had the nut replaced to lower the action, still plenty high for slide.

[3acorns]

That's Santa Rosa, California.

[snakehips]

Hi again !

I’m not after any payment for the cog but would need postage & packaging paid for though.

Just so I’m 110% sure exactly what bit you need, please post a photo of just the part you need a replacement for, for the voice of doubt.

Or you could PM me and we could discuss further over emails

All the best,

Richard

PS. That’s a particularly lovely looking Style O.
Can you let us all see more of the guitar, please - full frontal, and back ? The serial number is also good info to have, for Mark Makin, who has written an excellent book on vintage Nationals and has the largest (by a long shot) the most complete serial number listings for all models of Nationals and other related brands (Valco/Supro, and Dobro, Regal etc). If you don’t feel happy to post the serial number here, at least please consider messaging Mark Makin here, or on Facebook with tour guitar’s serial number. Every serial number helps estimate better when changes in guitar spec occurred, and other aspects of the understanding of National guitars.

[3acorns]

Here are more photos and serial number. It came with the pick guard. I'll PM you about the gear sprocket wheel (see detail photo of part).

[Michael Messer]

Hello 3acorns

Welcome to our forum.

I am not going to get involved with the replacement of your tuner cog, but I am going to say that you have a beautiful very clean and well looked after National Style O, that is on the way to being as good as it gets. I am sure you have removed the strings because of the broken tuner, but I don't think the guitar should be tipped on its side and moved around with nothing holding the resonator cone in place. This component is fragile and can easily get damaged if is rattling around under the coverplate. So please put a couple of strings on, maybe the two outer E strings and don't tune them up to pitch, just put enough tension on to hold the cone in place. After so many years the tension should not have been taken off, but it is done now. Please consult us on every move you make with your father's beautiful guitar and it will be fine.

The pick guard is lovely and apart from those two hairline cracks, it is in lovely condition.

Just reiterating what Richard has said - Please could you let us know the serial number of your guitar. It is stamped into the brass body down by the tailpiece.

You have a beauty there.

Shine On
Michael

[3acorns]

Thank you Michael,
I'll be more careful and get some strings on it. I'm really appreciating your site and getting in touch with this group. Here's the serial number.

[Michael Messer]

Jun 11, 2024 21:17:32 GMT 3acorns said:

Thank you Michael,
I'll be more careful and get some strings on it. I'm really appreciating your site and getting in touch with this group. Here's the serial number.View Attachment

My pleasure.

Last night while looking at your guitar and offering advice I was and still am intrigued by one particular aspect of this instrument, which with this small detail might well make it unique "so far". I have said "so far" because I have learnt that with National and Dobro instruments one can never be sure about what is going to turn up next week.

The unusual thing about your guitar is that as far as we can tell, the "we" is myself and Mark Makin, we have not seen another 12 fret Style O with a pickguard. And while that pickguard is the same design as the ones on some later 14 fret Style O guitars, it is not the same shape, it is longer.

This does not put your guitar into a position of much higher value, but it is a rare and possibly unique instrument.

I don't discuss values or valuations on this forum, but I can tell you that your guitar is at the top end.

Do you have its original case, and if so could we see some photos of it please? I have seen many original cases, but I have a feeling and I hope that your dad will have looked after it very well.

This is, as I said in last night's post, a very beautiful instrument indeed.

Shine On
Michael

[zimmharpo23]

Hi there

Just chiming in, what a beauty!

Cheers

Andy