Replacement Tuners For National 14 Fret Style O

[riverrunner]

Hello, and I hope you don't mind if I submit my first post.

I would like to ask if anyone's changed out the original fit tuners on National Style O?
Mine is a 14 fret, 2016 model, and, whilst the instrument is great and sounds good, the tuners originally fitted by the factory are really stiff and jerky.
It's difficult to tune accurately to pitch, as the tuners jerk when trying to fine tune.

I find this really annoying, being used to the Gotoh's on my Martin's which are as smooth as you'd like.
Just wondering if Waverley or Grover, or any other manufacturer make a high end tuner that'd be a straight fit without drilling?

Failing that, anyone got any tips, born of experience, on how the original tuners can be improved?

Sorry to jump straight in with a question, but I'd really appreciate any advice that readers may have.

Thanks very much,

Andy

[pascal]

Waverly's are the best, roll royce, but not cheap www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_Parts/Tuning_Machines/Slotted_Peghead_Guitar_Tuning_Machines/3-on-Plate_Waverly_Machines_for_Slotted_Pegheads.html

Look at the exact spacing first.

[Michael Messer]

Hi riverrunner,

Welcome to our forum.

Before changing your tuners I would suggest using a little oil on each one and giving them a good spin with a string winder. If that doesn't help, buy something better. They are pretty basic tuners, but they should work. On a brand new guitar you could always ask NRP to send you a new set.

Shine On
Michael

[Deleted]

Good advice from MM there.Gotoh's are super smooth so the National tuners are bound to feel a bit rudimentary in comparison.
I'd be inclined to persist with them for a while before changing anything.

[riverrunner]

Wise information, many thanks,

I'll try oiling the tuners, any particular lubricant that works best without damaging the wood finish please?
Think it may need a string change anyway, I've played it a lot since I bought it 6 months ago.

The string changing without displacing the biscuit or cone advisory threads are useful reading.
Such a great source of information for us affecionado's.

Learning all the time,

Thanks again,

Andy

[Pickers Ditch]

Tri-Flo Superior Lubricant is the best lubricant I've found so far.
It comes in a small squeezy bottle with an applicator tube and you only need a touch per tuner.
Like Michael says apply it and spin the tuner fully a few times.

[slide496]

I use Tri-Flow as well.

[Michael Messer]

I use regular 3 in 1 multi purpose oil.

Shine On
Michael

[Michael Messer]

Hi riverrunner,

I just noticed that you mentioned marking the wood with oil. I am only talking about the tiniest globule/droplet of oil on each tuner. The droplet should be no more than the size of a pin head. Drop it on the point where the two cogs meet, wind it round a few times and then remove any excess, if there is any, with tissue paper. There should not be enough oil to mark anything.

Shine On
Michael

[snakehips]

Hi there !

I use bicycle chain lubricant - it's got teflon in it.
You can use oil or "grease" instead but dust&grit tend to stick in it and clog up the gears eventually.

Take the strings off so the tuners can freely rotate easily, with a string-winder (circa £2 in most guitar shops).
Soak in a drop of lubricant into the gear by turning the string post at least a full 360 degrees in both directions.
Then if needed, add one more drop and work it in again. By lots of turns in both directions.

I'm not a fan of NRP's tuners - never have been.
I did improve the NRP tuners on my Style 1.5 GS Tricone with lubricating them but ultimately, I took off the tuners completely and replaced them with Stewmac tuners instead. Much better feel when using these. Not expensive either (for 3-on-a-plate slot-head tuners).

Lubricant.
String winder.
Stewmac tuners. www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_Parts/Tuning_Machines/Slotted_Peghead_Guitar_Tuning_Machines/Golden_Age_Restoration_Tuners_for_Slotted_Peghead_Guitar_-_Square-end.html

[Michael Messer]

Dec 17, 2016 9:17:20 GMT snakehips said:

I use bicycle chain lubricant - it's got teflon in it.
You can use oil or "grease" instead but dust&grit tend to stick in it and clog up the gears eventually

....I have never had a problem with dust and grit clogging up my tuners. I only use the tiniest droplet and don't use any more until it's all disappeared a few years later.

Shine On
Michael

[alexandre]

Dec 16, 2016 20:22:12 GMT riverrunner said:

any particular lubricant that works best without damaging the wood finish please?

Oil of vaseline is the very best, it's offering a great protection from corrosion, ask to any watch or clockmaker.
3 in 1 multipurpose oil is better for an unjamming purpose.
The oil of Vaseline is more fluid and lubricates weapons, locks, hinges... It is a "clean" grease, colourless and not very sticky for dusts, fluently used in the electrical equipment, the small mechanisms as those of sewing machines, or also to protect chromium or polished pieces against corrosion.

[blinddrunk]

Dec 17, 2016 9:17:20 GMT snakehips said:

I'm not a fan of NRP's tuners - never have been.

I fail to understand how NRP can produce premium quality instruments costing several thousand pounds and then fit such low grade tuners.

My '32 tricone has been retro-fitted with NRP tuners and I hate them. They don't inspire confidence and they remind me of the ones fitted to a cheap old classical my mate had when we were kids where the plastic knob fell off and it had to be tuned with a pair of pliers.


I will, however, try lubricating them - I'd always understood that to be a no-no.

[alexandre]

Hello,
I've just found another oil that can be used with a lot of different materials...
... and it's safe for wood & people !!

Seen on a website about knives, it can protects the metal of the blade from corrosion without danger in case of eating.
It's called BALLISTOL Universal, made in Germany.

Here it is:
www.ballistol.de/94-1-BALLISTOL-Universal-Oil.html

[petej]

I use bicycle dry lube its not oily and wont make a mess and you only need a very small amount,so as Michael says a very small drop will do the job,i use a fine artist paint brush.
petej