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Post by gaucho on Oct 30, 2012 2:32:02 GMT
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Post by Mark Makin on Oct 30, 2012 9:44:26 GMT
Hello Gaucho What do you think?  The Estralita has a larger and fatter body (It is a grand concert model), it has a FLAT headstock (not slotted). It has very obvious fancy fret markers (The guitar you show does not) and it is nearly 2 inches deeper in the body than a Trojan. It was designed for orchestra players and was a 14 fret replacement for the El Trovador which had a 12 fret body join. By deepening the body, the huge sound was maintained after shortening the fret access This guitar, you have pictured is a 12 fret guitar and is probably an El Trovador. I say that because it features the ring of black and white binding around the Coverplate which is unique to Trovadors and Estralitas. A serial number on the top with either an H or K prefix would help solve the mystery. However, whatever it is, if it has a well set National cone in it, I would grab it quickly for $500! Best Mark |
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Post by Stevie on Oct 30, 2012 10:32:07 GMT
OTOH, it's on Craigslist. There was a Stefan Sobell on Craigslist a while back for something like £1500. It just happened to be on Shetland. I asked Stefan and he confirmed that guitar went to a player in Scandinavia. The seller was only too willing to send it to me, or I could come and collect if I wanted to. Yeah OK....It's going to be a steal at 500 bucks, but you've got to be able to shake hands over the transaction.
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Post by gaucho on Oct 30, 2012 11:44:36 GMT
El Trov was what I was thinking too. I've never seen any "copies" of those either. The guy says there is no serial # on the headstock, did they ever make them like that? Sure wish I wasn't 1200 miles away, I'd check it for sure. That is, if it doesn't get washed away by Hurricane Sandy. NYC is taking a big hit right now.
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Post by slide496 on Oct 30, 2012 13:10:57 GMT
Hi Gaucho,
Don't think it will ship directly if you get it - going to be hard to get around, ship or any of that for this week in alot of areas from NY or if any UK ordered guitar supplies have to go through JFK. Power might be down in Clinton Hill, not sure.
My area was not flooded so its hard to get an idea of any damage except from the news.
Peace,
Harriet
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Post by Mark Makin on Oct 30, 2012 13:32:22 GMT
Hi Gaucho
No, they would all have had serial numbers. The El Trovadors were numbered with a K -(Kay made during 1932/3) and H - the final run were made by Harmony until 1934 when the Estralita took over.
The only Nationals made without serial numbers were those made under license for Trade House Companies or catalogues. I don't know of any El Trovadors made for this type of sale. It is most likely a case of sanding off of the original.
Best
Mark
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Post by Matt on Oct 30, 2012 22:52:52 GMT
It has what I think is a very distinctive el trovador shaped body. Are there any others with that distinctive exaggerated pear-type shape mark?
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Post by Mark Makin on Oct 31, 2012 11:18:38 GMT
Hello Matt That's why I mentioned that if this guitar has a ... 'well set National cone in it"... it is worth buying. There were a lot of instruments sold through catalogues under various names such as 'Monarch', 'Recording King', 'S.S Maxwell' etc that had EXACTLY the same shaped bodies as El Trovadors with the same f holes (probably even made by Harmony) BUT they had the, less than efficient 'Schireson' pudding bowl cones in them that hang from the body top with no well under the coverplate. Here is an example  Over the years I have seen a number of them that have been converted to 'El Trovadors' with the addition of a sound ring, National cone and Coverplate - in fact I've even done it myself! However, as I said earlier, I'm pretty sure that this instrument under discussion IS actually an El Trovador because of the inlaid binding around the coverplate. Best Mark |
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Post by rbe on Oct 31, 2012 16:46:27 GMT
Interesting. The holes for the coverplate screws are not drilled where they usually are on Nationals and there are eight screws on this guitar, rather than nine on a typical National. They do correspond to the position on the Kay version, which often has the Schireson cone. Nice guitar for $500!
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Post by Mark Makin on Oct 31, 2012 18:29:23 GMT
Hello Rik
That's the other thing that is throwing me off about this - also there are no ribs on the coverplate. I've never seen a Trovador without ribs.
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