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Post by creolian on Dec 27, 2018 13:50:05 GMT
Hello,
as I've been simultaneously talking myself into and out of buying a new cone for a guitar I'm just not quite happy with, finding some on gbase and posting here. and discovering there are "tall" cones that will effect tone and setup...
...searching the forum using terms "tall" and "cone" I have come across something else I never would have considered without y'all.
Apparently a taller cone and shorter saddle will tilt the tonal response of a reso toward the bass. I'm wondering if anyone has tried this with the intent of changing tone ? My Delphi sounds a bit thin for my tastes or at least thin and more trebly and metallic than the Beard or the Republic. No buzzing or other untoward behavior, I've been thinking of selling it. After fixing its previous owners attempts at lutherie, the guitar plays well, but just doesn't sing like I want it to.
Any thoughts or experience in regards to changing cone height and how it effects tone and setup much appreciated.
tia, and all best,
jeff
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Post by bonzo on Dec 27, 2018 15:15:56 GMT
Strings!
Best wishes to you all, John
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Post by creolian on Dec 27, 2018 16:18:56 GMT
Strings! Best wishes to you all, John Hi Bonzo, First thing I usually try as it's the one bit of "lutherie" I'm comfortable with  Ive tried three different brands, .12s and 13.s even tried some flat wounds I had. ( a nice metal jazz box sound). Currently .13s DR sunbeams. It sounds much better than when I first got it. im not a fan of listening to recorded samples on the web to judge how a guitar sounds. Kinda flying blind with this one as I've never heard another Delphi, but I have a feeling it's not as good as it could be. Thinking about it, I realized I've never so much as touched a tricone... maybe 15 years since I've seen one in the flesh. Maybe that would fix things... Just fishing indoors today as it's Winter in NOLA ( hot and humid, everything goes out of tune) flash flood watches and all that. Thanks for the thought 😎 B well! Jeff |
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Post by Pickers Ditch on Dec 27, 2018 16:36:42 GMT
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Post by bluesdude on Dec 27, 2018 17:17:59 GMT
Hello, as I've been simultaneously talking myself into and out of buying a new cone for a guitar I'm just not quite happy with, finding some on gbase and posting here. and discovering there are "tall" cones that will effect tone and setup... ...searching the forum using terms "tall" and "cone" I have come across something else I never would have considered without y'all. Apparently a taller cone and shorter saddle will tilt the tonal response of a reso toward the bass. I'm wondering if anyone has tried this with the intent of changing tone ? My Delphi sounds a bit thin for my tastes or at least thin and more trebly and metallic than the Beard or the Republic. No buzzing or other untoward behavior, I've been thinking of selling it. After fixing its previous owners attempts at lutherie, the guitar plays well, but just doesn't sing like I want it to. Any thoughts or experience in regards to changing cone height and how it effects tone and setup much appreciated. tia, and all best, jeff Hey there I have experience with all the different NRP cones, the first ones Don Young made were little lower than vintage ones, then they made a new batch in the nineties that were taller by quite a bit they were very trebley just like the previous! the hot rod cones are noticeably smoother like the vintage cones ,,, A fellow had me work on his Delphi for the same reason and I added a proper reproduction felt 100% wool,tuned the guitar to open A for a couple of months to seat the cone ! He is still very happy with it nearly a decade later you can't tell there is anything different in volume from any other Delphi! you might get away with just swapping the cone to a hot rod though,,,, Kenny,,, |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2018 17:42:01 GMT
Hello, as I've been simultaneously talking myself into and out of buying a new cone for a guitar I'm just not quite happy with, finding some on gbase and posting here. and discovering there are "tall" cones that will effect tone and setup... ...searching the forum using terms "tall" and "cone" I have come across something else I never would have considered without y'all. Apparently a taller cone and shorter saddle will tilt the tonal response of a reso toward the bass. I'm wondering if anyone has tried this with the intent of changing tone ? My Delphi sounds a bit thin for my tastes or at least thin and more trebly and metallic than the Beard or the Republic. No buzzing or other untoward behavior, I've been thinking of selling it. After fixing its previous owners attempts at lutherie, the guitar plays well, but just doesn't sing like I want it to. Any thoughts or experience in regards to changing cone height and how it effects tone and setup much appreciated. tia, and all best, jeff IMHO,having once owned one (briefly),the Delphi was never anything to write home about Jeff and you could be flogging a dead horse trying to improve the sound of it.Get shot of it and buy a Duolian--your in the right country! Here's another opinion: LINK I do stress the IMHO though and in all fairness it was 1996 when I bought mine. |
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Post by washboardchris on Dec 30, 2018 11:07:54 GMT
Having been a banjo player for years (in lots off ways a reso is a banjo in another name )rule of thumb ,steeper the break angle the sharper and thinner the sound) you could try a strip of leather or a small wooden wedge under the tailpiece assuming the action is fine for you to take the pressure off.the idea that greater the break angle the more volume is not viable,too much pressure can choke the cone.hope this is some help
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Post by Michael Messer on Dec 30, 2018 11:47:39 GMT
Jeff, The Delphi does have a particularly heavy body, but I think that from what you have said, this is all to do with set up. I don't believe that a new cone (unless yours is damaged) will improve things, but I do think the correct setup will. It is always so difficult without the guitar in my hands, but maybe you could post some photos showing the details of the current setup; string height, break angle, saddle and biscuit etc... Happy to help, but I need as much info as possible, or a return flight ticket to NOLA Shine On Michael |
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Post by creolian on Dec 30, 2018 14:12:02 GMT
Jeff, The Delphi does have a particularly heavy body, but I think that from what you have said, this is all to do with set up. I don't believe that a new cone (unless yours is damaged) will improve things, but I do think the correct setup will. It is always so difficult without the guitar in my hands, but maybe you could post some photos showing the details of the current setup; string height, break angle, saddle and biscuit etc... Happy to help, but I need as much info as possible, or a return flight ticket to NOLA Shine On Michael Hello Michael, all I get myself going in too many directions sometimes and things not on the list are sometimes forgot. When I got this guitar it was understrung, sounded really bad... and was priced accordingly. Initially I went on a quest to lower the action by changing tailpieces. I ended up taking your initial advice Michael, put it back in factory trim, lowered the action by cutting the saddle... the one thing I had intended and have forgotten about was the felt gasket. ( Thank You, Kenny ) intuition tells me that should move the tonal response toward the mellow, maybe tighten up the bass a bit. The gasket issue was pointed out before and I apologize for getting sidetracked... again I'm very grateful for the forum as I would never have known about any of this. Without a local reso specialist here, short of importing Michael, this forum has saved my beans more than once Current plan is, put a felt gasket in it and then go with a new cone if it still isn't up to snuff. If nothing else, if I decide to part with it, I won't have sunk a fortune and someone else will get a good deal. It's got an appropriately shallow break angle and the strings are not jumping out of the saddle, nor are the grooves cut too deep, nut is clean and in good shape. It plays well, just sounds a bit weak and unfocused in the lower end for my tastes. i have some thin automotive grey felt around here somewhere that at least looks age appropriate and won't dye my guitar innards red and green like the felt Christmas stuff I'm looking at I'm off to search the issue, any advice on felt gaskets much appreciated. wishing all a Happy and Prosperous New Year ! World Peace ! True Love ! Perfect Pitch ! and a winning lottery ticket... all best, Jeff P.S. one of these days Michael.... I've been hipping a few friends to the collision of Musical cultures that you are exploring. Don't be too surprised when Dr. Ike wants to book the "Messer Round" at the ponderosa stomp 🎶 Ponderosastomp.com. link |
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Post by Stevie on Dec 30, 2018 14:29:25 GMT
Ponderosa? Isn't that Spanish for "The Map's On Fire?"
e&oe...
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Post by creolian on Dec 30, 2018 14:50:18 GMT
Ponderosa? Isn't that Spanish for "The Map's On Fire?" e&oe...In this context it's a Lazy Lester tune but for the first twelve years of my life... Now I'll have the theme from "Bonanza" playing in my head all day. THanks Hoss! 🤠|
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Post by Michael Messer on Dec 30, 2018 14:59:27 GMT
  Jeff, I will reply in detail later... just thought this had to go in before I go out! Shine On Michael |
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Post by Stevie on Dec 30, 2018 15:16:27 GMT
Which all goes to show that if you look hard enough, you'll always find some benefit to bring old(er). Now where's me specs?
e&oe...
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Post by bluesdude on Dec 30, 2018 20:45:52 GMT
Jeff, The Delphi does have a particularly heavy body, but I think that from what you have said, this is all to do with set up. I don't believe that a new cone (unless yours is damaged) will improve things, but I do think the correct setup will. It is always so difficult without the guitar in my hands, but maybe you could post some photos showing the details of the current setup; string height, break angle, saddle and biscuit etc... Happy to help, but I need as much info as possible, or a return flight ticket to NOLA Shine On Michael Yeah I second the proper set-up! the way the saddle slots are cut can have a huge impact on a tinny sound! Kenny,,,,,,,,,, |
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Post by Michael Messer on Dec 30, 2018 21:25:35 GMT
Jeff,
Kenny is right on the money. There is no question about it. The way those slots are cut is so important.
The NRP Delphi has never been my favourite of their guitars, but 'tinny' is not a thing I have noticed, so before fitting the felt gasket I would really make sure you have done as much as possible setup-wise.
I would be very interested to talk with the Ponderosa Stomp people!
Shine On
Michael.
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Ive tried three different brands, .12s and 13.s even tried some flat wounds I had. ( a nice metal jazz box sound). Currently .13s DR sunbeams. It sounds much better than when I first got it.
