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Post by seanw on Oct 18, 2018 14:24:30 GMT
First of all can I just say thanks to everyone on this forum theres so much info on here this is the first question ive had to ask in two years. A few months ago I managed to get my hands on used mm blues which I love.The thing is there is a creaking noise coming from the heel? I noticed this when I first go it if I pick it up by the neck without supporting the body.I always pick it up with two hands now im just hoping I haven't done any damage by manhandling it.it stays in tune perfectly and sounds great to me I really don't care about the noise just thinking something has come loose or broken????im no guitar tech fitting strings is about my limit should I get it looked at? thanks sean |
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 18, 2018 14:34:36 GMT
Hi Sean
I am certain it is nothing serious and I am sure it is nothing you have done. Can you post a couple of close up photos and let me have the serial number, please?
Shine On
Michael.
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Post by seanw on Oct 18, 2018 15:46:38 GMT
Thanks for the reply Michael I will take some pics tonight.
I cant see anything obvious no cracks or gaps but then again I don't really know what im looking for.
thanks again
sean.
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 19, 2018 7:35:36 GMT
Hi Sean
I am not looking for cracks either, I just want to see your guitar before commenting.
Shine On
Michael
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Post by seanw on Oct 19, 2018 10:26:37 GMT
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Post by maui_chimes on Oct 20, 2018 1:08:49 GMT
A lot of things come together at the neck heel. I'm not sure how this particular model is built, but on a National the neck stick is glued into the neck heel, and the fingerboard is screwed into the wood below the top. One of those things is probably loose?
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Post by rbe on Oct 20, 2018 17:34:43 GMT
What I think you are finding is that when pick up the guitar by the neck, you feel and hear a click or creak as though the neck is moving. You then wiggle the neck expecting it to move and creak again, and it doesn't. You only have a sense of this problem when you first pick up the guitar by the neck. It's a strange one, but real.
If you check things out, most likely you would find everything tight and fit well. There are no gaps at the heel or under the fretboard flap. On further inspection you would most likely find that the posts/pads are well fit, the screws in the pan are tight and shimmed, and the fretboard extension is properly shimmed and fit. So everything seems right, but there is an almost imperceptible movement in the the neck, body joint that manages to make noise and you feel it. If everything isn't tight and properly fit, taking care of that is the first thing to do and may solve the problem.
I have found this situation on some Duolians that I have just fully (and properly) reassembled. Apparently, back in the day, National did too. This problem explains why many of the vintage instruments from National had hide glue puddled in the neck joint from the inside of the guitar. The dried glue filled the gaps and stopped the movement causing this problem. Works every time. Titebond works, too.
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 20, 2018 18:29:35 GMT
Thanks Rik. That is exactly what I think it is and I couldn't have explained it better. Very much appreciated.
Sean, what Rik has said is spot on. Titebond will sort it.
Oh....just so you know - I have found MMB0200 10 in the records; your guitar was shipped to its first owner in Hartford, Cheshire, in June 2010.
Shine On
Michael
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Post by seanw on Oct 20, 2018 18:54:27 GMT
Thanks rbe that first paragraph describes my problem exactly it creaks when i first pick it up then it seems to settle down.It stays in tune and The intonation is spot on i love this guitar i just wanted to make sure nothing was a miss.Thanks for the info Michael . Best wishes sean
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Post by seanw on Oct 21, 2018 8:08:32 GMT
Can anybody recommend a luthier in northwest England who Could do this job for me? my local guy is great but he has no experience with resonaters Thanks sean
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Post by richclough on Oct 21, 2018 16:56:34 GMT
Hi,
I can recommend Steve at Beltona guitars near Leeds. He has just done a great job on my NRP Tricone, which amongst other things was suffering from the exact problem described - application of glue inside the guitar around the heel area sorted it out. Michael gave me Steve’s name.
Regards
Rich
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Post by seanw on Oct 21, 2018 19:30:46 GMT
Thanks richclough i know he's highly regarded on here. Thanks for everybodys help much appreciated Best wishes sean
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Post by lexluthier on Oct 21, 2018 22:18:22 GMT
Hi! My lightning does the same thing but decided not to fix it until next time I have to strip the thing down, which I am in no hurry to do. As they say, 'if it aint broke, don't fix it', and it is not broke, it's just mildly anoying and I'd rather put up with it as is than lose the bedded in 'bloom' in the sound for any length of time.
Anyway..., I was slightly suprised to hear the advocation of Titebone in this senario. Titebone is the luthiers glue of choice for wood to wood bonding but as hide glue is traditional in this situation and is used on MMs guitar(all the ones I've seen anyway) why not just use it again? It sets hard in a situation that's more about filling/packing than it is glueing and is easy to reverse and reset in the future. Titebone, while not suffering from the shrinking problems you might have in the long run with hide glue, is not as hard but more importantly it's gonna be a b&$%h for the next guy to work on. Just sayin'..........
Chris
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