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Post by Larry Conrad on Oct 10, 2004 0:38:23 GMT
Great pics! This is an amazing thread. Thanks Paul. First point is easy: the Triolian I sold was serial no. 2727W (I was advised not to put whole serial numbers on the Internet, but this was on your old forum anyway Michael.) Second point, concerning the new photographs. This is just what I see, but here goes: 1) The location is entirely different. The original Triolian Man photo was taken against the background of old rural buildings in what looks like undeveloped farm country. Home sweet home!!!! The new pics from Paul Wheldon show urban houses with concrete sidewalks, mowed lawns, decorative shrubs, and so forth. So these were taken in a town. The house in the first new pic is also set up off the ground, which was done if you lived near a river that might flood. You can still see these kinds of houses up and down the Susquehanna (You never heard of it? Its the longest unnavigable river in the world! ;D). 2) The time is different. Triolian Man, if its the same guy, is older, a bit heavier in the face, and his hairline has receded. The clothing looks exactly like what women wore in the late 40s. The soldier in the last two pics is probably a guy back from the war. The house in the last two pictures is also the sort of thing that was being built for returning GIs, who could get cheap mortgage loans from the government. Before the war houses were built of stone or wood, like the one in the first two pictures, but the huge housing market by the late 1940s was producing houses mainly made of brick. Those silly awnings over the window were all the rage in American suburbia, very "chic", but they got torn to ribbons in every big storm and eventually people got the idea and gave up. Schoolboys hated those things! It was so stupid running out in a gushing rainstorm to run the crank to fold them back so they wouldn't get ripped, then back out after the storm to extend them to dry, otherwise they would get moldy. At the first crash of thunder you would hear your Mom's voice: "Laaaaa-ryyyyyyy......." Grrrrrrrr. 3) Does anyone else wonder if the woman with the Triolian is just posing? The way she is holding the Triolian isn't exactly you showed me in Exeter Michael. Maybe it's epoxied to her dress and the upper end of the body filled with cement? 4) Can anyone date the Martin guitars? Note that Triolian Man doesn't even TOUCH one! Ahhhhhhhhh. I'm off to bed a happy man.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2004 0:51:08 GMT
The woman does seem to be posing to me too. She at least has a pic on her index finger. The Triolian man is the same man as in the other 2 photos. His clothes seem older in the solo picture too. He is wearing a double breasted coat. I'll send a higher qualiy scan of him to MM. The Triolian Serial # is right for the guitar. The W means it was a walnut sunburst finish. Same as in the picture. wheldon
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 10, 2004 11:26:30 GMT
Hi everyone, This is great. First of all, this is only my opinion, but I think that "Triolian Woman" can play lap slide guitar. Not to a very high standard, but she can play. Her playing/posing position is typical of a female player of her time. Larry, I agree about how she is holding the guitar, but this was probably so she could retain her dignity (Hawaiian guitar is like horse riding, ladies do it side-saddle....well at least for photos they do!). I reckon she is wearing a thumbpick and possibly a fingerpick (Wheldon, I would really like to have high res' copies of these photos....please?). The other thing I have noticed is that I think they are all playing an 'F' chord together. The Triolian would be in open 'A' for that to fit the other two. Also her hands do look 'in control' and the left hand is dampening properly - my opinion is that she could play Hawaiian guitar. Maybe not as well as Sol Hoopii or Sam Ku West, but she could pick a tune in this style......I would money on it. Here is an enlarged pic of her hands, I can't go any bigger because it pixelates, but if I can get the high res' scans.....that would be wonderful. Thanks Wheldon. Regarding the serial number of the chrome-plated Triolian - yes Wheldon is absolutely correct, the W is correct for a walnut Triolian and it is the original owner's initial! Thanks everyone for contributing to this fascinating thread. Shine On, Michael.
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Post by Larry Conrad on Oct 10, 2004 11:58:36 GMT
On the Triolian, here are a few more pics. The first is how it looked when I opened the case for the first time. It was padded with old newspapers, which I pulled out so I could get a picture of the whole body. The picture makes it look pitted, but it isn't. The plating was very well done, as the later picture taken in my house shows, and it was a fine-looking instrument. The second photo is the headstock, which some people have been discussing. The National decal is gone of course, and the corners of the headstock look like they have been rounded off for some reason?
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 10, 2004 14:06:58 GMT
Hi Larry, Thanks for posting those photos. It is hard to tell, but possibly the fretboard was changed when the guitar was plated. There appears to be an angle cut on just after the last fret, which also happens to be fret 20. Triolians have 19 frets. Willard's Triolian in the old photo has 19 frets as it should! I have a feeling the fretboard may be a new one, the frets look a little more yellow/brassy than they should. Could we see a picture please? I wish you could just email me the guitar, like in 'The Fly' movie! ( I am sure it'll happen ) The Headstock does appear to have been smoothed down on the corners, they are always a bit rounded but on yours it does look like it has been cleaned up with some sand-paper. I have seen this before on restored guitars. Luckily, by the sound of it, they have not sanded off the serial number. Here are some photos of the Triolian on Notecannons, which is the same as Willard Johns' in the photo. Shine On, Michael.
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Post by Larry Conrad on Oct 10, 2004 15:31:08 GMT
Here's a photo of the fretboard, and yes, it does look like that was replaced sometime. The newspapers used to pad the guitar had stories about a big battle at Khe Sanh (sp?) in Vietnam, by the way. I don't remember when that was anymore, but the papers were all yellowed and dried up and it looked like the guitar hadn't been touched since then. The case was thick with dust and the fittings were functional but a bit rusty. The serial number was on the top of the headstock, exactly as in your example from Notecannons, with the numbers and the W unevenly spaced, as if each number had been stamped into the wood separately. I tried getting a photo of the serial number, but it was difficult to read anyway and I could not get a good legible photo. I am already wishing I had kept that one. I kept taking photos and now I'm glad I did. This will sound like shameless promotion, but if anyone is interested in seeing another guitar from the same "collection", check out the Regal-built 1935 Model 27 Dobro on the LRC site.
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Post by Richard on Oct 10, 2004 22:36:57 GMT
What a great thread, Conan Doyle couldn't have done it better. And, I'm with you Michael, in that the lady was lap player as she has that 'damping left hand grip'
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Post by Larry Conrad on Oct 12, 2004 11:13:46 GMT
Any thoughts on the Gibson ( that Triolian Man is holding in the first two pics provided by Paul? What model is that?
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 12, 2004 22:58:23 GMT
Hi everyone, In connection with this fantastic thread; I have been sent a selection of old photographs of people with their resophonic guitars to display on this forum. Thank you very much to Paul Wheldon for taking the trouble to scan & email these wonderful photographs. Interestingly, it turns out that Paul was the person who originally found the photos of Willard Johns and sent them to Colin McCubbin back in 2001, who then sent them to me.....etc. Warren Caplinger's Dixie Harmonizers. Front row left to right: Everett Caplinger, Warren Caplinger, Charlie Bowland, back row left to right: Andy Patterson, Dave West. The writing on the back in pencil... "banjo Dobro band photo 1920's" This was written much later. ..on the back in pencil...."Andy and Cap". Of course it's Andy Patterson and Warren Caplinger. On back in pen... Raymond Beasley. (Trojan guitar with binding) on back in pen.. "All Very Sober" (catalogue resophonic guitar) (No writing on back.) Rider's of the Rio Grande. (No writing on back) (The guy sitting is holding a yellow Polychrome Triolian & the guy to his left is holding a yellow wood-bodied Triolian, which in this writer's opinion was & still is National's best kept secret. MM) On back in pencil - "Xmas 1949" (No writing on back) On the back in pencil..."Mrs Juel Pawlik". The initials on the upper bout are J P. (I have another different pic of him in black & white, and one that has been hand tinted in color. P.Wheldon). On the back written in pencil..."The Silver Spring Trio. Harold Shover, Lester Shover, Colo." Notice the front says Silver String Trio, the back says Silver Spring Trio. On the back written in red ink... "Best of luck Caddy small "The Granite State Cowgirl" Aug 9, 1939" (another yellow Polychrome Triolian) These are wonderful photos Paul, thank you. Shine On (and keep searching!) Michael.
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Post by Kevin on Oct 14, 2004 8:31:53 GMT
The picture of the Catalogue guitar, the guitar looks like a faux reso, the f holes appear to be too close to the cover plate, the cover plate appears to be quite flat, and the bridge does not look quite right.
all the same, great pictures though. I love that guitar the cowboy is playing, and the woodbody with the two women. Great stuff. Kevin.
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 14, 2004 13:54:36 GMT
Hi Kevin,
That particular guitar (all sober now photo) is difficult to identify. There were numerous budget priced resophonic guitars produced with all kinds of brand names, and as you mentioned some did not have diaphrams at all, they were just fakes. However the guitar in the photo looks to me like an S.S. Maxwell 'Granada Model' (I can't be sure, but I think it is). These were sold through Targ & Dinner in Chicago, who were also dealers for National, Dobro & Regal. They were not fakes, just very cheap resophonic guitars.
Shine On, Michael.
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Post by Richard on Oct 15, 2004 22:19:59 GMT
I found this on my web travels the other day, it's certainly one I have not seen before, possibly any early EBA concert
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Post by Michael Messer on Oct 18, 2004 23:46:33 GMT
They just keep on coming! This great. I just received this photograph & email from Sam Palmer, UK based Hawaiian guitarist & ex hurdy gurdy maker. SAM'S EMAIL > Dear Michael, Here is scan of a 1930s French picture 78 record I own. The picture quality is as good as it gets being a fuzzy picture distorted further by being viewed through the yellowing clear plastic grooves. The record reads "No 20 Fotosoner 50101/2 - Charming Maids of Honolulu (on the A side) and - One Two Three Four (on the reverse side). Sonny Cunha - Orchestre Hawiien Arnau" Et Chant I can find no record of the guitarist but he does look a lot like Len Fillis.He is holding a National style 2 round neck guitar with a raised nut, he is wearing picks. Who is he? Prehaps you would like to put it on your web site. Regards Sam Thanks Sam, much appreciated. This thread is amazing. Shine On, Michael.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2004 1:22:10 GMT
Are there any master numbers in the dead wax? I suspect it is The hawiaan Serenaders.
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Post by Alan on Oct 19, 2004 12:45:53 GMT
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