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Post by snakehips on Jul 26, 2009 19:23:37 GMT
Hi there !
That MM Blues sure does look cool ! The colouring is great - especial the gold over the centre of the coverplate.
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Post by robn on Jul 27, 2009 10:07:12 GMT
Thanks Snakehips, I love that MM Blues - it is the guitar I reach for before all others as it is my "guitar for all seasons". It was a cosmetic second from the very first shipment so it became our test guitar for a while and ended up being well beaten up Now she is set up with a hybrid action (3mm bass and 2.5 treble @ 12th fret) and MM Newtone Nickel 13-56 strings that have been on for about 9 months of hard playing (I think I had better change them this week as they are getting pretty tatty and hard to tune ). I'm a bit of a fan of MM Newtone pure nickel strings on the MM Blues simply because they suit my style of playing on that particular guitar, which tends to be thumping chopped rhythm and lead licks, stuff people want to move with. The way I play that guitar is about as subtle as a flying brick and has all the finesse of an elephant ballet dancing ;D Most players can work the richness of BP strings beautifully - but it is the "thud" of pure nickel on the MM Blues that floats my boat All the MM Blues have that gold hue on the coverplate when the light catches them Robin
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yoyopoc
MM Forum Member
Serious Piehead Reso Dude
Posts: 18
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Post by yoyopoc on Jul 27, 2009 13:14:24 GMT
Hi everyone, I play an Amistar Duotone with P90 and piezo fitted as standard, never use the piezo, sounds dreadful, brittle and hard as they always do, in my opinion. P90 through my Hartke Acoustic attack pre amp into my heavily modified Fender Pro Junior, gives me clean with an edge with lovely tube warmth and when required, some real lovely delta grunge distortion. When recording, di'd through a neve 5016 with a Crowley and Tripp naked eye ribbon mic on the Fender, through the mic preamp stage of the neve 5016, gives me a huge range of sounds. Just love the touch of a good tube amp, real dirty is the way for me ;D OH yes, MM nickels all the time.
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 18, 2009 13:35:18 GMT
I have followed this thread with interest in the past, and now, as it has popped up again in the new 'amplifying resos' thread, I feel that I have been around long enough to I show my ignorance of all things technical.
Does anyone have any idea of the difference between an sm57, which everybody agrees is the way to go, the Shure Beta 57 and most importantly as it is the one currently available the Beta 57a?
I know that the Beta 57a with its narrow forward sensitivity is listed as a 'sound reinforcement' mic, but it is a great vocal mic too! Can it be used for micing an acoustic guitar?
The SM 58 with its wide patten is a great vocal mic and works really well mic'ing amps too! Does anyone use one on an acoustic?
An old 515sb that I have does everything pretty well too!
The whole subject is too confusing - especially as the sm57 is a cardiod and the Beta 57a is a 'super' cardiod, does the metalic blue ring substitute for the red cape and cloak? Seriously in laymans language -what is the difference between cardiod and super cardiod?
And what difference does a tube mic pre-amp make?
Is it all Hoodoo and for that matter, what is the difference between Hoodoo and Voodoo?
Cheers Perce
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Post by honeyboy on Sept 18, 2009 15:54:41 GMT
CardioidA microphone polar (pickup) pattern. Characterized by strong sensitivity to audio from the front of the mic, good sensitivity on the sides (at 90 degrees, 6 dB less than the front), and good rejection of sound from the rear, the Cardioid pattern can almost be visualized as a "heart-shaped" pattern (hence its name). The ability to reject sound from the rear makes Cardioid patterns very useful in multi-miking situations, and where it is not desirable to capture a large amount of room ambience. Popular in both studio and live use (where rear rejection cuts down on feedback and ambient noise), Cardioid mics are used for a very high percentage of microphone applications.Keep in mind that like all non-omnidirectional mics, Cardioid mics will exhibit pronounced proximity effect. SupercardioidA polar pattern name used to describe the pickup pattern of some microphones. The Supercardioid pattern is very similar to, and often confused with, the Hypercardioid pattern. The Supercardioid pattern is slightly less directional than the Hypercardioid pattern, but the rear lobe of sensitivity is also much smaller in the Supercardioid . HypercardioidA polar pattern name typically used to describe microphone pick up characteristics. Hypercardioid patterns are similar to Cardioid and Supercardioid patterns in that the primary sensitivity is in the front of the microphone. They differ, however, in that the point of least sensitivity is at the 150 - 160 and 200 - 210 degree positions (as opposed to directly behind the microphone in a Cardioid pattern). Hypercardioid microphones are thus considered even more directional than Cardioid and Supercardioid microphones. Hypercardioid microphones are frequently used in situations where maximum isolation is desired between sound sources. HoodooThe word hoodoo first was documented in American English in 1875 and was listed as a noun or a transitive verb. In African American Vernacular English (AAVE), it is often used to describe a magic spell or potion, but it may also be used as an adjective for a practitioner. VoodooThe word vodĂșn is the Gbe (Fon-Ewe) word for spirit. When the word is capitalized, Vodun, it denotes the religion. When it is not, vodun, it denotes the spirits that are central to the religion. "Voodoo" is the most common pronunciation amongst English speakers.
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 18, 2009 18:26:11 GMT
Thats magic honeyboy .
Thanks very much for that.. Although I sort of knew that, from the way things work, its good to have it explained.
I guess that the proximity effect is when it gets louder the closer it gets? Which is one of the problems I have always had with playing a mic'd up guitar. If I move, either I bash the mic, or nobody can hear me.
If I understand your explaination I may be right in thinking that the Beta 57a does actually do a better job than the sm 57?
I guess that it is the same kind of relatioinship between the PG 58 and the sm58.
So the next thing I need to know is how to make sure that mic's are in phase, (and of course the connection between SanterĂa and La Regla Lucumi).
Cheers Perce
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Post by Michael Messer on Sept 18, 2009 19:03:04 GMT
Hi Percy, I have tried the new versions of the SM57 on a few occasions. This may be because I am so used to an original SM57, but I did not get on with either the Beta 57 or the Beta 57a. I have tried them at sound checks and always returned to a regular SM57. I am sure they are better for certain applications, but to mic up a National or Dobro style guitar I haven't found anything that can touch an original SM57. Thanks Honeyboy for the Hoodoo & Voodoo definitions Shine On Michael.
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Post by honeyboy on Sept 18, 2009 19:04:05 GMT
Perce,
Proximity effect is a big (usually unwelcome) increase in bass response as a cardioid type microphone gets nearer the sound source.
The proximity effect in audio refers to a change in the frequency response of a directional (cardioid) microphone.
The result of the change is a disproportionate increase in the bass response of the microphone.
This is a by-product of the way cardioid type microphones work mechanically, and isn't usually a problem with an omnidirectional microphone, for example.
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Post by Michael Messer on Sept 18, 2009 19:21:35 GMT
Honeyboy, the proximity effect is what is so great about working with a resonator guitar and an SM57. Lots of control over the sound; mic over the coverplate both near and far, mic over the F holes both near and far, and variations of those!
Gotta go....I'll catch up tomorrow
Shine On Michael
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 18, 2009 20:39:28 GMT
Thanks again Honeyboy
That makes much more sense than the graphs that come in the pamphlets, websites etc. A great help. What I really need is a Ladybird Book of Tech talk!
Michael - I understand entirely sticking with the mic that you know works the way that you want it to. I was recently surprised that my vocals I sounded better through a Beta 57a than through an SM58 even though I was under the impression that it was meant for mic ing amps. - Its what I have seen them used for.
It is all so variable right from the strings that we use. I like the snarl of a heavy brass slide on wound strings others would have all plain strings and a glass slide. (I think that we would all agree that we need as much mass as possible whatever the slide material though).
The sound of an instrument is itself very subjective and once we get into amplifying that hard won tone, so much the more so.
Without meaning to start into qualia, people perceive and appreciate different aspects of the same sound. The differences in valve amps and transistors for instance - I always loved the way that old HH, early Peavy and Trace Elliot amps sounded. Quite different harmonic (?) overtones to the valve amps around at the time. In the same way, I always preferred the warmth of a Marshall amp compared to most Fenders. I didn't really use effects until I got myself a Fender twin. And, once I had, I tried all sorts to make it sound different.
The sound that we produce is central to what we do, and the sounds that we each strive to create are also very distinct. We all hear things differently and what I think of as the perfect reso tone may be very different to the way you think of it. It is really helpful to have access to the information here to enable me to select the best tools to achieve my personal vision. I couldn't think of an audial equivalent of vision( ?)
But thanks for the help getting there guys.
Cheers Perce
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 19, 2009 10:18:53 GMT
That 'proximity effect' is one of the reasons that I have problems with mics. It is not so bad when recording in a controlled studio environment but even there I don't want to have to think about the mic or where it is.
I would actually like to just reproduce the acoustic sound that I make but louder. I would also like to do that without being frozen to the spot. I am too old and easily distracted to make anything attatched to any part of me remain within 1 inch proximity to a microphone.
I have used a Rode NT3 from time to time as it gives me a bit more freedom but, why don't people use shotgun mics? They can sound great. They have a 'greater depth of field'. Wouldn't they give a greater degree of performer movement?
'Another thing' as Colombo might have said - When mic ing the F hole and the bridge do you place the mics together and angle them out in a V shape towards the sound sources so that you don't have to think about phasing or do you angle them in?
I have seen John Ottway performing with an SM58 tied to a coat hanger which was placed round his neck so that he could play guitar and run about like Madonna on the cheap. Is it time for the Mighty MM industries to come up with a coat hanger for holding a guitar mic at the right height above an F hole? It could be shaped like a palm tree and nickle plated for that vintage vibe!
Cheesy grin and a shrug!
Perce
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Post by Michael Messer on Sept 19, 2009 10:38:51 GMT
Hi Percy,
If you want to move around on stage you need to use a pickup of some kind. If you want to produce the acoustic sound of your guitar through a PA system or acoustic amp, there is (in my opinion) only one option. Highlander makes two systems for National-type guitars; one for Tricones and one for single cones. These are not cheap, but nothing else compares to them.
A while ago Robin at Busker Guitars was fitting Schatten pickups to MM and Busker instruments as a budget-priced option for amplification. I am not sure if those pickups are still stocked by Busker.
Magnetic pickups are fine, but they do not reproduce the natural acoustic sound from the cone. They do have a bit of cone-tone, but most of the sound is like an acoustic-electric guitar.
Shine On Michael
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 19, 2009 10:52:26 GMT
Wow that was fast- A microphone does give the best reproduction and I guess that I am looking for the best of everything. I don't move about too much but I would like to have a bit more freedom.
Having been through several options fishman etc., I use schatten pick ups in a single cone and a tricone. I find that the one for the tricone works best. Possibly because it doesn't come into contact with the cones. I happily use magnetic pick ups on regular guitars.
Cheers Perce
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Post by Michael Messer on Sept 19, 2009 11:15:18 GMT
Hi Percy, Speedy service!!! If you want to get the best of both worlds, try using both the pickup and the microphone. That will give you a range of tones and two or more volume settings. If you want an equivalent mic to a Shure SM57 that will pick up your guitar further from the mic, try a Shure SM58. Set the PA's main EQ to a frown with the mid-range at around zero and set the mic input EQs flat, maybe with a bit rolled off the top for warmth. The settings of the pickup vary with each instrument & pickup. I also take off all or most reverb on the guitar inputs as it can cause problems. If you use monitors with a set up like that, keep the volume low as a reference to the out-front sound. I usually set monitor levels at the same volume as my guitars so I can still hear the actual sound coming from my guitar. I hope that helps Shine On Michael
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Post by percythewonderant on Sept 19, 2009 16:02:32 GMT
Indeed that helps. The EQ and monitor level info is invaluable too. Luckily my reverb habit is something that I grew out of many years ago.
I don't use a lot of anything on resos as they don't seem to demand anything other than strings a slide and finger picks.
If using an amp with acoustics I go through a very early Trace Acoustic 100r, which I have used for years. Conveniently it has inputs for Jacks and XLRs and can go straight to a desk. It seems 'bullet proof' I know what it will do and I am used to it. It is always clean. I have always appreciated the very 'transparent' nature of the amp. I guess that there are much better ones around now but It is part of what I do.
Cheers Perce
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