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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 13:51:36 GMT
Hi everyone. I'm posting because it may be of interest and also for advice/opinions. I'm giving my 33 Duolian a good service, lowering the action, cleaning and oiling the fretboard new strings etc. I've had the guitar a couple of years and although I love it I and one or two others whose opinion I respect have thought it was just not quite as good as it might be. Screws on cover plate were a mix of types and of course two were a right s*d to get out! Anyway cover plate is off, no damage done. Cone was clean and looking good. Not sure if it's original but the biscuit does have the patent applied for stamp. Have compared it to a spare continental cone I have, although similar there are differences. Photos posted, opinions please. Under the cone was a circle of felt type material, I've read about this but never seen it. I'm not going to put it back, must have been affecting the sound so I'll see what it's like without it. I removed the bridge and cleaned it and tidied the slots to be a better fit for the MM 15's I'm going to use. I was going to reduce the height of the bridge to lower the action but I won't now. I think removing the felt packing might give me the mm or two as far as lowering the action goes. Let me know what you think please. Best wishes to you all, John
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Post by Michael Messer on Nov 11, 2020 14:12:31 GMT
Hi John That looks to me like an NRP cone, not an original. The biscuit is an original, but may not be from that guitar. The felt gasket is a personal taste thing. In some guitars it works wonders and in some it does the opposite. Give the soundwell rim a good clean because it may have bits of glue from the gasket. A set of proper screws would be well worth getting. Rik Besser of B .Fanatic Guitarworks had some made a few years ago and would be the best person to get some from - www.bfanaticguitarworks.com/?page_id=43I hope that's helpful Shine On Michael
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Post by obrienp on Nov 11, 2020 14:16:53 GMT
Hi, I am by no means an expert but I understand that felt is often used as a fix for when the well is not true,ie, has warped. In fact this fix was used on my NRP Radiotone Bendaway at MM’s suggestion by Dave Hill. Obviously, get other, more knowledgeable peoples’ advice but you might find removing the felt introduces a rattle from a badly seating cone in the well.
Good luck! Pat
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Post by obrienp on Nov 11, 2020 14:18:45 GMT
Whoops! I was busy typing when Michael was posting. Follow Michael’s advice, not mine (as if you need telling). Pat
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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 14:33:21 GMT
Thanks for the quick response Michael and Pat. I did order up a load of screws from the states last year in anticipation of future repairs. Probably your suggestion at the time Michael. Nice slot head semi domed. I did a quick reccy and I think they'll fit. 🤞🤞! Yes Pat I've given the well a good clean and the cone sits nicely with no 'wobbling'. I think I'll leave the NRP cone in, all my reading on the forum has seemed to say not much difference between that and the continental cone. Thanks again, I'll let you know how I get on. Back to it!
Best wishes to you all, John
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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 16:29:05 GMT
So here she is, all back together again. Got the action down to three mm, strings sit nicely in their new slots, intonation fine and the screws went in and gripped fine. Ric Besser did a pretty good job of matching to the originals. Plays really nicely ,a noticeable improvement from before. Bigger warmer bass fuller sound in general. All in all I'm pleased with my efforts, thanks for your help. Best wishes to you all, John
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Post by Andymccann on Nov 11, 2020 18:28:35 GMT
Fine job. Fantastic guitar
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Post by snakehips on Nov 11, 2020 19:48:13 GMT
Hi there !
I’m v interested to know what Rik Besser’s coverplate screws look like.
I bought screws a year or two ago, from elsewhere - and they fit perfect, and look the part but the domed heads are just a little too tall, and the heads are slightly too wide (diameter). Still a good replacement. Got brass ones and stainless steel ones BUT couldn’t get nickel-plated screws
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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 20:32:20 GMT
Hi Snakey, here's a photo that I hopes helps. Like you I looked everywhere for ages with some results, even trying wood screws and adapting them. These imho are the closest to 'original' screws without doubt. I've used them to replace the odd missing screw on non Nationals but on this Duolian I replaced them all and I think they look the part. Hope this helps.
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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 20:37:36 GMT
Here's another, clear as I could make it!
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Post by 1928triolian on Nov 11, 2020 21:29:00 GMT
I ordered the replacement coverplate screws from Rik Besser for my 1930 Triolian, and I confirm: they work perfectly (looking "real", too) Nice service from Rik as a bonus.
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Post by snakehips on Nov 11, 2020 23:18:34 GMT
Hi again L I got mine from McMaster-Carr. A single one for my “slots” coverplate on my 1932 Style N - no one is gonna spot this one, under/between the strings, where my picking hand will also be in the way ! I replaced the Philips-head coverplate screws on my custom NRP Style 1.5 Tricone Attachments:
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Post by bonzo on Nov 11, 2020 23:30:29 GMT
They look good, slightly more domed than the ones I'm using but I think they both look the part.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2020 0:42:45 GMT
Nice lookin 33. Can someone post what is the spec for the screw? There are some old hardware stores around here that may just have some in stock. (They look like 3-48 oval head slot machine screws)
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Post by snakehips on Nov 12, 2020 5:57:39 GMT
Hi Fred,
I’ll double-check later on but I’m pretty sure it was 3-48, but “slotted, pan head” is what we all really want, instead of oval, domed, round etc.
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