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Post by linkous on Oct 27, 2021 6:49:45 GMT
Without any knowledge in lutherie or acoustics, these pupils built a resophonic Lap Steel, and studied its spectrum : because of the simplicity of the instrument, it was easy to switch, from the cone to a plain wood discus (with a bridge) making comparisons easy : we discovered that the main contribution of the cone was a strong reinforcement of some special frequencies : the [1000 Hz-3000Hz] domain, the exact zone of prominent human voice harmonics! Without much science about frequencies: Isn't the fundamental voice frequency (very) much lower? Something between 80 Hz and 300 Hz?
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Post by linkous on Oct 14, 2021 16:11:59 GMT
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Post by linkous on Oct 11, 2021 19:53:12 GMT
Very interesting and impressive, Mr. Lewis, if possible I would really like to visit your work shop! So you glue the veneer layer by layer and press it into plywood? I guess you don't produce the veneer yourself?
But you understand that this discussion is essentially not about the production of custom built guitars (how many guitars do you build in a day or a week?), but about mass production. I don't think the subcontractors (Kay, Harmony, ..) that supplied the bodies to National at the time are sorting veneer layers, guitar by guitar? If you start from a stack of mass-produced plywood sheets, then you can work a lot cheaper than with a solid maple plank.
And so, because of that economic reason, we were formed to consider the sound of these plywood resonators to be the best. We are CONDITIONED. In such a way that when a solid wood reso sounds 'different', we tend to consider this different sound as bad (or not good).
To end with my starting point: Sometimes a certain sound is a consequence rather than a goal. Many people confuse facts and conditioning.
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Post by linkous on Oct 1, 2021 11:55:29 GMT
Darryl, I'm currently building a reso that connects the neck to the body at the 13th fret. The body itself has the National '12-fret shape' (one day I will burn in Hell). This means that the soundwell has moved about 18 mm towards the neck. So I don't have an existing model at home to build (the plan to build my first resonator guitar consisted of nothing more than a photo printed in full size). Building a (reso) guitar is not rocket science, but I admit: you better be handy. You also have to take your time, think logically, collect information as much as you can and ask (yourself) a lot of questions. To answer your question: I do indeed use the average measure between 'the bridge placement distance' that a (Stewmac) fret position calculator gives of the first and sixth string as the center of the soundwell. So you have reasoned well. In case of a 635 mm (25 inch) scale, this is 638.5 mm (+ 3.5 mm) to be exact (from the fretboard edge of the nut, to the center of the soundwell). Then you can file the correct intonation within the thickness of the saddle. As soundwell diameter I take 245 mm, then you still have some space when adjusting. Good luck!
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Post by linkous on Sept 28, 2021 20:43:27 GMT
I think Darryl is looking for this, Pete: linkYou can also visit a painting, carpet or wallpaper store, darryl: link 2
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Post by linkous on Sept 28, 2021 11:09:54 GMT
I do not get much movement on the dome itself, Stevie, but that is in my case (and probably also in yours) because it is also well tensioned by wedges between neck stick and back. However, when I hold the guitars flat, in a way light can fall over it, at the back I notice a marked flexibility along the edges of the back. A flexibility that in my opinion is more difficult to achieve with wooden guitars, and especially with the solid wooden ones.
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Post by linkous on Sept 28, 2021 9:45:01 GMT
I don't know about your guitars, Stevie, but when I push on the backs of the steel guitars I have here at home, I do feel more flexibility than the wooden ones..
Thanks for your enlightening answer, Pete!
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Post by linkous on Sept 28, 2021 7:40:40 GMT
As soon as you deviate from the original invention to try and improve it, you ruin it (IMHO). That tends to be the rule of thumb for many things. Shine On Michael The prehistoric bow and African banjo (essentially a resonator pioneer) are genius concepts indeed, Mr. Messer, but if I understand correctly you don't see the resophonic guitar as a small link within the evolutionary process of stringed instruments but as an invention that came out of nowhere? Are you therefore inclined to claim that the first printing press could not be improved? The first telephone, the first stove, vacuum cleaner or… cabinet speaker? In this context: Fender cabinet speakers were made from solid pine for a long time. They are still considered the best by many guitarists today. But not by you? So are there any or many exceptions to your above statement? And finally: when the loudspeaker concept within a resonator guitar is so celebrated because of its robust properties, why did anyone ever decide to build that 'cabinet' from flexible steel plate of 0.8 mm thick? I'm not asking this to undermine your expertise, I'm asking because I want to understand all those contradictions. Thanks!
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Post by linkous on Sept 26, 2021 10:22:11 GMT
A small illustration from the book 'The History & Artistry of National Resonator Instruments' by Bob Brozman, to show why I suspect that the sound of certain instruments is sometimes more by chance (forced for economic reasons) than by choice. And an additional question (not intended ironically, in all honesty and out of pure interest): where does the idea or statement that a cabinet speaker should not be made of solid wood come from?
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Post by linkous on Sept 25, 2021 10:55:24 GMT
You consider Gibson a luthier, lexluthier?
We can ask the question from point 3 to a few forum members, don't you think?
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Post by linkous on Sept 25, 2021 7:33:13 GMT
I have yet to meet the first woodworker, cabinet maker or luthier who makes his own plywood sheets, but I can't wait to visit his workshop!
You can purchase plywood in a hundred types and qualities. Depending on the number of layers, thickness of the layers, gluing and types of wood, the options are: birch, pine, poplar, mahogany, beech or.. all kinds of tropical junk.
Have you ever think about what happens after a hundred years with plywood? How do glued layers from 1930 evolve (taking into the glue quality of that period)? Yes, indeed, about the same as the other glues on a guitar of that age. That this affects the sound needs no explanation. But no problem, because I've talked to just about all authorities on resonator guitars over the past decades and they all assured me that this was also the intention of Mr. Dopyera..
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Post by linkous on Sept 24, 2021 14:57:53 GMT
The most important word in your comment is 'probably', Bluesdude.
Furniture history was also covered during my training as a furniture maker. Strips of veneer glued to plywood were already used by the Egyptians, centuries before Christ. Veneer was sawn for a long time, but at the beginning of the 19th century the first veneer cutting machine came on the market. One hundred years later, plywood was already being used as packaging material in the USA..
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Post by linkous on Sept 24, 2021 13:04:10 GMT
Linkous, I am sorry, but you are wrong about that. The best National and Dobro guitars ever built were made of laminates. It would be ridiculous to call a handbuilt Fine Resophonic guitar a budget instrument, or would you? The use of laminates is because solid woods do not do the same job, it has nothing to do with costs. John Dopyera built wood bodied Triolians with laminates because it was better than using solid wood. The construction of such instruments is akin to a speaker cabinet, not an acoustic stringed instrument. A solid wood soundwell would really not be a good idea. Even the earliest square neck Tricones with wood sound wells used plywood, some were 10mm thick. Shine On Michael Of course plywood is the best material to build a guitar with, I don't argue with that either. It is easy and quick to process, with the result that it is also a much cheaper alternative to solid wood, which is welcome in mass production. So why would you work with solid wood on a guitar? In the case of a reso guitar, this is mainly a value determiner. A plank of mahogany is much more expensive, risky and also requires a lot more work. I hope I don't have to explain to you why a guitar from Fine Resophonic is more expensive than a Chinese copy? Moreover Fine Resophonic's guitars would be a lot more expensive if they were built from solid maple. I have a few solid wooden reso guitars at home, of which even the soundwell is solid. Do these instruments crack or fall apart? No. Do they sound bad? No. But maybe they don't sound 'correct' to the reso police?
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Post by linkous on Sept 23, 2021 13:20:40 GMT
The choice to use plywood or solid wood when building a guitar is on the one hand economical, on the other a value determiner. Wooden reso guitars were (and are) often cheap mass products. That this generates a certain sound is a consequence rather than a goal.
Many people confuse facts and conditioning.
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Post by linkous on Jul 30, 2021 10:03:35 GMT
So the question is, what should the neck angle be? I know old Nationals had a 90 deg neck angle, but this ain't no National. Should I aim for a neck angle that gives a sharper string relief over the bridge? Or should I just ignore the neck angle and fix the ski ramp? Thanks in advance, Mark Can you imagine how low the strings would come over the cover plate at a 90 degree neck angle, Mark? Because the tailpiece rests on the cover plate (and the strings are attached a little higher), you should actually have a flat cover plate to keep some string break angle..
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