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Post by ljohansson on May 19, 2015 12:24:24 GMT
I just bought an El Trovador. Great guitar, fantastic looking, fabolous sound. Now I have searched the internet for additional info about the model and found this. The supposedly last El Trovador( Kay made ) in 1933 had the serial number K555. Mine is K569.
How is this possible ? What are your views ?
Thanks Lasse Johansson
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Post by Matt on May 19, 2015 12:44:34 GMT
Probably just means it wasn't the last one made after all. They can only base things like that on what is known, and to be known a guitar has to have both survived and been reported to someone who's taking note.
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Post by ljohansson on May 19, 2015 13:17:07 GMT
My thoughts were that, like for instance Martin guitars, they kept a list on all guitars they made, serial numbers, models and dates. Bob Brozman, in his book The History of national Guitars..., mentions the K555 to be the last one made by Kay and I thought that he had access to most things about the National company.
Anyway, it seems my guitar has changed the book on El Trovador serial numbers.
Thanks lasse
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Post by Michael Messer on May 19, 2015 13:29:59 GMT
Hi Lasse,
Bob's book was written more than 25 years ago before the Internet was being used for research. For many years it was the only book available, but it is no longer the definitive document on this subject. Two years ago, Mark Makin released his book, 'Palm Trees, Senoritas & Rocket Ships' which has thousands more serial numbers listed than Bob's book does. It was Mark who helped Bob put those numbers together in the first place, and in the 25 years since then he has gathered thousands more numbers. I haven't checked El Trovadors, but I suggest you have a look.
Shine On Michael.
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Post by Mark Makin on May 19, 2015 14:56:19 GMT
Hi Lasse National may very well have kept details of numbers of instruments, unfortunately they have not come down to us. We do not have the luxury of "chapter and verse" like the Martin company have. We can only record what people bring to our attention.
The more items and numbers, then the clearer the picture. K555 was only the highest number we had seen back in 1993 - it was never assumed to be the last one made. We now have K619 and others above that. Anyway, after this range was completed by Kay in 1933, following an argument with Kay and National, the range was given to Harmony to produce a few hundred more. We have another set of records in the H serial number range from H021 to H159 (K for Kay - H for Harmony). Finally, by mid 1934, the range was dropped in favour of the (Harmony-made) ESTRALITA.
So, I'm afraid K569 does not "change the book" at all. It is a very useful number though, and becomes another valuable addition to the story!! Best Mark
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Post by billysmith on Jun 5, 2019 19:55:55 GMT
I recently emptied out my storage unit, and dusted off my old resonator which I haven’t played for at least five years. I purchased it in 2003 from Amazing Grace Music in San Anselmo, CA, and the receipt says 1933 National “Resoplon..” (second word grows illegible after the “p”).
The guitar looks identical to all images I can find of an El Trovador, and “K 5 7 1” is stamped on the top of the headstock. The only curious part.. no National badge on the front of that headstock. In the place where the emblem would be, there’s instead a very faded name stamped in small golden font ... I can barely make out any of it anymore. I would include photos but I don’t see that as an option here.
Please help me identify this beauty!
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Post by Michael Messer on Jun 5, 2019 20:15:38 GMT
Hi billysmith,
Welcome to our forum.
It is always best to see photos to be sure of what instrument we are discussing.
You can upload or link to photos already online, but none of these options are available in QUICK REPLY. Use REPLY on the bottom right of this message window
Upload photos by using "Add Attachment" or link to photos already online using the little picture icon to the right of the mail icon.
Shine On Michael
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Post by billysmith on Jun 11, 2019 5:04:34 GMT
Excellent! Thanks for the help, this is my first time here I included a few images of the head to show both the actual lettering (as best I could), and the shadow its indention creates. I also snapped two of the receipt and original pedigree from where I found her 16 years ago. Let me know if there are any others I can snap to help with the identification. & Thanks again!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2019 11:59:42 GMT
That's an El Trovador.Triple edge binding on body and around cone,slotted headstock and the f holes are the right shape for a Harmony bodied version.Also the s/n is only two above Lasse's guitar which kind of seals it.The shop,not being able to see a headstock decal probably took a guess as to model. Would you mind me asking what you paid for it as you MAY have got a bargain.
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Post by billysmith on Dec 23, 2019 9:31:49 GMT
Thanks for the help! And sorry for the long delay! I remember it being in the $1500-2k range. Has the warmest, most incredible sound. Sadly, not being a true slide player, I’ve only played it so much. I’m considering having the action lowered, so I can play it as I’d play any other guitar.
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