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Post by oscar on Jul 28, 2014 11:58:44 GMT
On some resonator guitars I hear very harsh overtones on th eupper three strings . Putting a weight of about 70 gr. or more on the strings between bridge and tailpiece mutes these overtones and creates the more midrangy sound I expect from a resonator guitar. This kind of mute is a remedy but still I don't know what causes the problem. Bridge slots, tailpiece, coverplate, cone? Has anybody ever have to deal with this problem? Never occured on a National, but on Continentals, Beltonas, Buskers. It occured on bridges with slots hardly visible and also with very deep slots. Also on wound strings (replaced an unwound 19 by a wound one, still the same harshness).
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Post by zak71 on Jul 28, 2014 15:49:19 GMT
Putting a weight of about 70 gr. or more on the strings between bridge and tailpiece mutes these overtones and creates the more midrangy sound I expect from a resonator guitar. Based on what you describe it could be caused by poorly cut string slots at the bridge, or too shallow a bridge-to-tailpiece angle, or a combination of both.
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Post by gaucho on Jul 28, 2014 19:05:23 GMT
I've run into this on a couple guitars that I had lowered tunings on. I was using Spanish tuning but lowered to the key E or even key of D. Seems some guitars just wouldn't go that low without weird, spooky overtones (I've seen them referred to as wolf tones). Tuning up to key of F or all the way up to regular open G usually cured the overtones or at least made the manageable with good muting technique. Don't know if that helps your problem…..
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Post by bluesdude on Jul 28, 2014 23:33:55 GMT
If its happening on the tree trebles its not the slots! check that the cone is not shifted to the treble side and/or the tail piece is leaning toward the bass side, and sometimes the cone is leaning against the well too hard, a FELT GASKET!!! will take care of that,,,,,,,,,
Kenny,
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Post by oscar on Jul 29, 2014 20:59:49 GMT
Thanks for your replies!
I decided to open one guitar and found that the cone has sunk in a little bit. It also tried to "climb" up the well/wall. Reshaped the cone and put in a felt gasket (maybe a little bit too thick). Sound is much better now. May improve even more with the new cone I am going to order.
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Post by zak71 on Jul 29, 2014 21:19:47 GMT
Make sure you give that gasket at least a week or two to "bed in" under the cone. In my experience with felt gaskets, they sound like crap at first, then abruptly come to life with full volume and increased bass. The correct felt should be 1mm thick. Bluesdude posted a link to a supplier of the "right" felt, it looks exactly like the old gasket in my Triolian. I put some in my Style O and it sounds fantastic (thanks, Kenny!). Here's the link: www.maplesplendor.ca/felt.htmIf you order, make sure you select the larger (40 x 30 cm) sheet size. #46 is pretty close to the original green.
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Post by oscar on Jul 29, 2014 23:54:05 GMT
Thanks for that link. The felt I used is 1 mm thick and very dense. I bought it here in Germany and it also comes in different colours and sheets of 30 x 40 cm.
The felt in my Duolian I remember being softer. But that was many years ago when I did not know much about Nationals. The felt seems to have been wet for a while and was almost disintegrating. That's why I removed it.
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Post by steadyrollinman on Aug 1, 2014 16:18:59 GMT
I struggled with a Duolian which sounded pretty dire due to harsh overtones for over a year. I thought about selling the guitar, but something held me back as I beleived it would finally come good one day.
The breakthrough came by making several changes:
1. Putting a felt gasket in the soundwell
2. Sanding the height of the nut so the strings cross the nut at the correct depth.
3. Ditto with the biscuit saddle
4. Felt pad under the tailpeice.
5. Last but certainly not the least, one of Mike Lewis's coveted single cones.
My good friend Marshcat advised me to persevere with it and told me that its not one particular thing makes a National good or bad, its every little thing.
Finally, all the above I did at home at virtually nil cost, the credit for the cone has to go to the Right Honourable Mike Lewis.
Hope this helps.
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