The other National Shield Amplifier

[Deleted]

Just found this recently. National Dobro Shield Amplifier with Webster Electric chassis. This has the cabinet that stacks up.



There is another Shield Amplifier that does not stack. Is that the Chicago Electric chassis?



Just wondering about the differences.

[Deleted]

I may as well post this answer to my own question...found some info...It seems that the Webster Electric based National Shield stacking-cabinet amp is cited as originating in 1935, while the National Shield non-stacking model B is as late as 1938 (hence being dubbed “model B”).



I see a difference in cabinet covering guessing the white cow skin is earlier...since the tan matches the Model B...assuming the above is correct...though should never assume...

[Mark Makin]

Hi Fred
Here are the "National Shield" amplifiers as I understand it.
1. From 1933 through to 1935ish, they were using the dark brown amps with metal coverplates featuring chicken feet patterns in various sorts. These were made by Webster electric.

2. During early 1936, they changed to lighter brown amps with three green vertical stripes and green/silver pressed National logos.

3. Mid 1936, the first of the "shield" amps appears. This is the small amp that you found with the cream covering that splits into a "stacked" form. This is listed in the 1936/37 catalogue as a 110v AC amp of 15 watts. It is designed to split so that it can work as a Hawaiian guitar stand. Also with it is listed the same amp as a universal AC/DC version. It cost $75.

4. In the next years catalogue (1937/8), a "shield" amp is listed as the Model A - with vertical stripes in the covering. This is specifically marketed as an electric violin amp. It is described as a 10 watt, 110v AC, high gain amp.

5. The same year, the Model B was issued. This was an 18 watt, 110V AC amp ..."for all high gain electric instruments".

6. The Model C also appeared at this time. This was a small suitcase-type amp, 10 watt, 110v AC. It was listed as a "Silvo" amp which probably implies that it was intended for use with the Silvo range of electric tenor, lap steel and mandolin.

[snakehips]

Hi Mark,

They were using "Chicken-Feet" pattern coverplate type speaker covers, as early as 1933 ?
Pre-dating the ones on National Style O's by about 3yrs

[Mark Makin]

Hi Richard
It is very difficult to be totally accurate about this. some sources say the early Lansing amps were "end of the LA period in 1933". Technically, the LA move to Chicago didn't happen for at least 12 to 18 months after this. Also, the Estralita has chicken feet by 1935 or so, so I'm afraid as long as we can get within a 12-18 month window, it is possible.

You could however, have a point about where the "chicken foot" idea comes from. It could easily be a design for these amp cover plates that distilled itself into a guitar coverplate design. On the amps, you may have noticed that some have a ring of 16 "feet" patterns, like the guitars, and some have 18 "feet" patterns.

[Deleted]

Mark thanks for the information. I found an interesting article by Michael Wright that includes some information about National switching from Webster to Chicago Electric then back to Webster for the amplifier chassis due to reliability issues with Chicago Electric...

I saw one of the early 3 green stripe amplifiers last summer when visiting Fred Oster Vintage Instruments in Philadelphia, but never saw it listed for sale.

[oldnat]

This is my matching Silvo outfit including the Silvo model amp



.

[joephoto]

I bought a National New Yorker and a National Model B with the back cover and canvas zippered wrap back around 1979.  A friend of mine took the amp and the Wurlitzer Spectratone speaker (in the background left) to do some work on them. The amp is missing one tube (second from left in the photo) and he replaced one of the 6L6 tubes. I think the missing tube is for the microphone input which doesn't work. The original problem is after about 10 minutes of playing it starts making like a feedback that won't go away until you shut it off. He seems to think he fixed that and I'll be getting it back Saturday (can't wait). There's still a buzz like some of the wood near the speaker is cracked but that doesn't concern me at this point. I'll run that and another amp to feed the Spectratone and see what I get. I've got some blurry schematics (for the model B) but I can barely read them. I'll post it anyway. I can't remember where I got it. From the original photo I make out the serial number to be B ?7089. I can't tell if there's a digit where the "?" is from the photo. Also, I saved a catalog page (maybe from this site - memory is slack lately).

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[Michael Messer]

Jun 27, 2019 4:50:21 GMT joephoto said:

I bought a National New Yorker and a National Model B with the back cover and canvas zippered wrap back around 1979.  A friend of mine took the amp and the Wurlitzer Spectratone speaker (in the background left) to do some work on them. The amp is missing one tube (second from left in the photo) and he replaced one of the 6L6 tubes. I think the missing tube is for the microphone input which doesn't work. The original problem is after about 10 minutes of playing it starts making like a feedback that won't go away until you shut it off. He seems to think he fixed that and I'll be getting it back Saturday (can't wait). There's still a buzz like some of the wood near the speaker is cracked but that doesn't concern me at this point. I'll run that and another amp to feed the Spectratone and see what I get. I've got some blurry schematics (for the model B) but I can barely read them. I'll post it anyway. I can't remember where I got it. From the original photo I make out the serial number to be B ?7089. I can't tell if there's a digit where the "?" is from the photo. Also, I saved a catalog page (maybe from this site - memory is slack lately).

Hello Joephoto,

Just a quick note to say welcome to our forum and that you have a beautiful amplifier there. Very nice!

I have been seen with one of these on occasions. This was in 2000. It didn't work at the time, it was just used for the photo session.



Shine On
Michael

[joephoto]

Just got my amp back today and had a chance to play with it. It was take two as the camera was set for a still in take one. It sounds a bit scratchy but it really kicks. Volume problems I think were due to my picking and the fact that the strap wasn't adjustable and the Synsonics V is difficult to play squatting down (yeah, yeah excuses excuses). I got the Spectratone speaker back and had some fun with that tonight but it will take some special microphone placement to get an effective video of it. THE VOLUME ON THE AMP WAS ONLY SET TO 2!! I tried six but it was rattling the knick knacks. The serial number on the amp is B 7089.

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[joephoto]

I almost thought about posting this as "Maybe for Sale Soon" on Tin Can Alley tonight but need a lot more advice as I don't use any online payment systems, have no bank account, wonder about shipping and other things that might prevent me from a successful sale. My friend Dave, who worked on it and got it running again thinks I should sell it and buy one of the little THR (I think that's the brand) amps like he has that sound like a big stack of Marshalls with all kinds of settings and effects built in but I'm still on the fence. I guess I could always take some of the cash and register my alter ego's name (He Who Cannot Be Named (until he registers the name with the trademark office)(not the musician "HeWhoCannotBeNamed"))) and get to work on trying to make some music.

[Pickers Ditch]

Don't sell it, you'll regret it!

IF you really, really NEED those funny effecty, push button thingies, buy cheapo Danelectro pedals and put them through it.

Just my tuppence worth.......